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Fén Ghír: Difference between revisions

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"Ce" is also typically used as "about": "They are talking '''about''' that" becomes; ''Té ghír '''ce''' ítá me ló.''
====Prepositional Application====


Debh implies doing something with the aim of one thing but not achieving it or at least where the success is in doubt. This gives it a slightly different application than the English word "Towards"
===== Ce, Cu & Cór =====


Cóbh and Cébh imply only position and time, rather than a goal:
Words following Cór are the ones which are "under" the words preceding it while similarly, those following Ce are the ones over the subject. This is applied consistantly within Fén.


"They came '''after''' me" becomes "Bhé bhoc '''debh''' di me ló" unless one means "They arrived after I did"
Thus if someone were in an unfortunate, horse related, accident and wanted to signal their location they would say,


The prepositions with multiple types can be determined by either syntax or subject following it:
{| cellpadding="4" style="line-height: 1em;"
*Accusative/Locative ambiguity is resolved by whether or not the case precedes the Nomative Noun.
|+
*Locative/Temporal is resolved by whether the action listed is a place or a time.
<!-- Sentence -->
It is worth noting that the translations here are done with an English subject-object relation in mind rather than the word order one:
| colspan="8"| "''Té líren cór di!''"
|-
<!-- Pronunciation-->
| colspan="8"| /te lirɛn kor dɪ/
|-
<!-- Morphemes-->
|<small>té</small>
|<small>líren</small>
|<small>cór</small>
|<small>di</small>
|-
<!-- Gloss-->
|<small>Is</small>
|<small>Horse</small>
|<small>Under-</small>
|<small>-1S</small>
|-
<!-- Translations -->
| colspan="8"| "I'm under a horse!"
|}
 
Or alternatively, if asked why she wasn't helping to clear the wreckage, a quicker witted survivor might declare
 
{| cellpadding="4" style="line-height: 1em;"
|+
<!-- Sentence -->
| colspan="8"| "''pon éloc té di ce líren''"
|-
<!-- Pronunciation-->
| colspan="8"| /pɑn elɑk dɪ sɛ lirɛn/
|-
<!-- Morphemes-->
|<small>pon-</small>
|<small>-éloc</small>
|<small>di</small>
|<small>ce</small>
|<small>líren</small>
|-
<!-- Gloss-->
|<small>Because</small>
|<small> the.reason.that</small>
|<small>1S</small>
|<small>over-</small>
|<small>-horse</small>
|-
<!-- Translations -->
| colspan="8"| "Because there is a horse on top of me"
|}
 
If this survivor was to be participating in the Trojan Wars and her same dimwitted friend sought to find her, she might find context to utter such a phrase as,
 
{| cellpadding="4" style="line-height: 1em;"
|+
<!-- Sentence -->
| colspan="8"| "''té di cu líren''"
|-
<!-- Pronunciation-->
| colspan="8"| /te dɪ sɛ kʊ lirɛn/
|-
<!-- Morphemes-->
|<small>té</small>
|<small>di</small>
|<small>cu-</small>
|<small>-líren</small>
|-
<!-- Gloss-->
|<small>Is</small>
|<small>1S</small>
|<small>in-</small>
|<small>-horse</small>
|-
<!-- Translations -->
| colspan="8"| "I am in the horse."
|}
 
Or alternatively, if asked why she wasn't helping to clear the wreckage, a quicker witted survivor might declare
 
{| cellpadding="4" style="line-height: 1em;"
|+
<!-- Sentence -->
| colspan="8"| "''pon éloc té di ce líren''"
|-
<!-- Pronunciation-->
| colspan="8"| /pɑn elɑk dɪ sɛ lirɛn/
|-
<!-- Morphemes-->
|<small>pon-</small>
|<small>-éloc</small>
|<small>di</small>
|<small>ce</small>
|<small>líren</small>
|-
<!-- Gloss-->
|<small>Because</small>
|<small> the.reason.that</small>
|<small>1S</small>
|<small>over-</small>
|<small>-horse</small>
|-
<!-- Translations -->
| colspan="8"| "Because there is a horse on top of me"
|}
 
In addition to this ''cór'', ''cu'' and ''ce'' have more metaphorical uses as well.
 
''Cór'' is often used to refer to qualities, particularly transient ones, which are related to an object.
 
''Cu'' is used for a more existential link between objects, one not related to qualities but rather something inseparable to person proper. Often the phrases in which ''cu'' are used, rather than ''cór'' are ones which make use of a determiner and make a statement about being a '''particular''' thing rather than having a certain quality (or set there of).
 
''Ce'' by contrast is may be used in to refer to a subject of an action or discussion, like how we would look ''at'' something or talk ''about'' something.
 
{| cellpadding="4" style="line-height: 1em;"
|+
<!-- Sentence -->
| colspan="8"| "''Té balin rinob cór tílan ít''"
|-
<!-- Pronunciation-->
| colspan="8"| /te balɪn rɪnob kor tilan it/
|-
<!-- Morphemes-->
|<small>té</small>
|<small>balin-</small>
|<small>-rinob</small>
|<small>cór-</small>
|<small>-tílan-</small>
|<small>-ít</small>
|-
<!-- Gloss-->
|<small>Is</small>
|<small>weak-</small>
|<small>-writing</small>
|<small>under-</small>
|<small>-book-</small>
|<small>-this</small>
|-
<!-- Translations -->
| colspan="8"| "This book is poorly written"
|}
 
compared to,
 
{| cellpadding="4" style="line-height: 1em;"
|+
<!-- Sentence -->
| colspan="8"| "''Té  tílan ít ce balin rinob''"
|-
<!-- Pronunciation-->
| colspan="8"| /te tilan it ce balɪn rɪnob/
|-
<!-- Morphemes-->
|<small>té</small>
|<small>tílan-</small>
|<small>-ít</small>
|<small>ce-</small>
|<small>-balin-</small>
|<small>-rinob</small>
|-
<!-- Gloss-->
|<small>Is</small>
|<small>book-</small>
|<small>-this</small>
|<small>over-</small>
|<small>-bad-</small>
|<small>-writing</small>
|-
<!-- Translations -->
| colspan="8"| "''This book is about poorly writing''"
|}
 
If one were to maintain the order and say, ''Té balin rinob ce tílan ít'', it would be interpreted as "[There] is bad writing on this book" which would be a strange construction but it could be interpreted as meaning "The reviews of this book are poorly done" [though that would generally be pluralized to "''rinoba''" or "writings"].
 
Finally, cu can play two roles here, first is if "weak writing" is not followed by a determiner, in which case it retains the more general meaning of in;
 
{| cellpadding="4" style="line-height: 1em;"
|+
<!-- Sentence -->
| colspan="8"| "''Té balin rinob cu tílan ít.''"
|-
<!-- Pronunciation-->
| colspan="8"| /te balɪn rɪnob ku tilan it/
|-
<!-- Morphemes-->
|<small>té</small>
|<small>balin-</small>
|<small>-rinob</small>
|<small>cu-</small>
|<small>-tílan-</small>
|<small>-ít</small>
|-
<!-- Gloss-->
|<small>Is</small>
|<small>weak-</small>
|<small>-writing</small>
|<small>in-</small>
|<small>-book-</small>
|<small>-this</small>
|-
<!-- Translations -->
| colspan="8"| "There is bad writing in this book."
|}
 
Which conveys that part of the book, though not all of it, contains weak or poor writing. However under other circumstances, cu serves to mark two things as fundamentally inseparable. For this an absent minded Dóthan looking over some old notes and remarking what tripe it is, Dim if he were in the room, might declare to her;
 
{| cellpadding="4" style="line-height: 1em;"
|+
<!-- Sentence -->
| colspan="8"| "''Té balin bhérinob ronéb ítá cu tílan ít.''"
|-
<!-- Pronunciation-->
| colspan="8"| /te balɪn verɪnob rɑneb ita: ku tilan it/
|-
<!-- Morphemes-->
|<small>té</small>
|<small>balin-</small>
|<small>-bhe-</small>
|<small>rinob</small>
|<small>ronéb</small>
|<small>-ít</small>
|<small>cu-</small>
|<small>-re-</small>
|<small>-ba-</small>
|<small>-rinoba</small>
|-
<!-- Gloss-->
|<small>Is</small>
|<small>weak-</small>
|<small>Aux.PST.Adj-</small>
|<small>-Write.Adj-</small>
|<small>-tripe-</small>
|<small>-this</small>
|<small>in-</small>
|<small>-2S-</small>
|<small>-POSS-</small>
|<small>-book</small>
|-
<!-- Translations -->
| colspan="8"| "This badly written tripe is your book!"
|}
 
One final point with these particular prepositions, which does carry over to others, is that there is an important difference between the accusative/dative and locative sense of these prepositions. Those that precided the subject, are accusative or dative and those that follow are locative.
 
{| cellpadding="4" style="line-height: 1em;"
|+
<!-- Sentence -->
| colspan="8"| "''Bhé lé ce genem me Dacob.''"
|-
<!-- Pronunciation-->
| colspan="8"| /ve le sɛ gɛnɛm mɛ dakɑb/
|-
<!-- Morphemes-->
|<small>bhé-</small>
|<small>-lé</small>
|<small>ce-</small>
|<small>-genem</small>
|<small>me-</small>
|<small>-Dacob</small>
|-
<!-- Gloss-->
|<small>Aux.PST-</small>
|<small>-Go</small>
|<small>Over-</small>
|<small>-Bridge</small>
|<small>SBJ.Aux-</small>
|<small>-Jacob</small>
|-
<!-- Translations -->
| colspan="8"| "Jacob went over the bridge"
|}
 
{| cellpadding="4" style="line-height: 1em;"
|+
<!-- Sentence -->
| colspan="8"| "''Bhé lé me Dacob ce genem.''"
|-
<!-- Pronunciation-->
| colspan="8"| /ve le sɛ gɛnɛm mɛ dakɑb/
|-
<!-- Morphemes-->
|<small>bhé-</small>
|<small>-lé</small>
|<small>me-</small>
|<small>-Dacob</small>
|<small>ce-</small>
|<small>-genem</small>
|-
<!-- Gloss-->
|<small>Aux.PST-</small>
|<small>-Go</small>
|<small>SBJ.Aux-</small>
|<small>-Jacob</small>
|<small>Over-</small>
|<small>-Bridge</small>
|-
<!-- Translations -->
| colspan="8"| "While over the bridge, Jacob went."
|}
 
=====Del, Do & Debh=====
 
There are some notable uses of these differing from English that I will remark on once I skim over to record them.
 
=====Rel & Cun=====
 
Comparatives; like this or unlike this. Will expand but it is mostly self-evident in my opinion.
 
=====Rú & Núr=====
 
Instrumental By vs. Nearby. An important distinction. Will be expanded.
 
=====Tonúr, Núr & Cu=====
 
Surrounding, Nearby and actually inside/amongst. Will be expanded, but is mostly self evident
 
Inside v. amongst for ''cu'' is marked by whether the thing is plural as it is difficult to be inside multiple things. Some ambiguity certainly, but not much more than you would get if someone said "He is inside them" or "He's in the lions".
 
 
=====Nédén & Nér=====
 
Fairly different but have an similar inherent contrast to them.
 
''Nér'' is used in the sense of something which resists the action; You fight against someone or hit a book against a table. "Del'' is an alternative, at least dialectically; "Fight to him" or "Hit book to table" but it's a weaker contrast and can lead to ambiguity; "I raced north against you" using "del" rather than "nér" could also mean "I raced northwards to you".
 
Nédén is something facing another thing, especially from opposite a threshold. It's more complex in terms of when it is used, but is also rare.
 
=====Cóbh, Cébh, Debh & Cur====
 
Relatively self-explanitory. May expand on the difference [of lack there of] between time/place but it seems pretty well congruent to English.  
 
I may remove Debh looking at it now as it is relatively useless. The main purpose originally was to draw a distinction between "I will do this before"/"I have dones this before" and "I will do this until"/"I did it until". However, the perfect form might removed that ambiguity; "I had been doing this before" could read just as easily as "I had done this until" and similarly with the future and until; "I will be doing this before".
 
=====Pon & Tén=====
 
Not overly complicated but give a reason and a point of view.
 
First to note is that pon is followed with ''éloc'' when the reason is a subclause [which is most of the time] an example would be, "I did this because of what you said before". It isn't when it is followed by a single word or noun-phrase, thus "I did this for you" or "You should have done it for that reason" would omit ''éloc''


A is under B can translate to Té B cór A or Té A ce B. This translation assumes the former in order to avoid switching voices.
Tén is something that would be translated as "According to" or something along those lines, it makes the sentance subjective to a degree.


Because of the relatively strict word order and preposition use, there is no declension or suffixes to differenciate between adjectives, adverbs, nouns and verbs.
*1S: Used to subjectify, "I think".
*1P: Used to clarify or expound on rhetoric, "We say that..."
*2S/P: Used to clarify "You're saying?", "You said" [ie. "You said X previously!"].
*3S/P: Used to subjectify, "According to him..."
*4S/P (Ígel/ibh): Used to generalize, "Its said that..."


====Other prepositions====
====Other prepositions====
Line 1,511: Line 1,849:
|-
|-
<!-- Pronunciation-->
<!-- Pronunciation-->
| colspan="8"| /Tɛl he pɛl'ɑk cór alɑn e'gɑl nɛ bel ber cor i'gɛl ba ben'an'a/
| colspan="8"| /Tɛl he pɛl'ɑk kor alɑn e'gɑl nɛ bel ber kor i'gɛl ba ben'an'a/
|-
|-
<!-- Morphemes-->
<!-- Morphemes-->
Line 1,656: Line 1,994:
|Please...
|Please...
|''Och dir bér me re cór di...''
|''Och dir bér me re cór di...''
|/ɑx dɪr ber mɛ re cor dɪ/
|/ɑx dɪr ber mɛ re kor dɪ/
|-
|-
|Thank you
|Thank you
|''Tel thé bér cór re''
|''Tel thé bér cór re''
|/tɛl he ber cor rɛ/
|/tɛl he ber kor rɛ/
|-
|-
|You’re welcome
|You’re welcome
|''Tel thé lú bér cór re''
|''Tel thé lú bér cór re''
|/tel hɛ lu ber cor rɛ/
|/tel hɛ lu ber kor rɛ/
|-
|-
|Good bye
|Good bye
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