Linguifex - User contributions [en]

Talk:単亜語

2026-01-02T08:42:00Z

物灵: /* A reference on the role of sino-xenic morphemes in Japanese/Korean */ new section

==SVO and postpositions==
SVO languages predominantly use prepositions. Indeed, there are notable exceptions that employ postpositions. Finnish is a prime example of an SVO language with postpositions, despite its Proto-Uralic roots suggesting a more verb-final structure. In West Africa, several Niger-Congo languages, such as those spoken in Côte d’Ivoire and Ghana, maintain SVO word order while using postpositions. And Guarani, an indigenous language of South America. However, I do not know any of those languages and cannot speak for them.

Using SVO with postpositions will cause excessive 之’s. The structure ‘推墙的人’ is frequent in Mandarin, where there are no postpositions and ‘的’ undergoes controversial analyses. But it is not elegant to copy the structure in Dan’a’yo as something like ‘毀滅垣之人’. ‘人其毀滅垣’ or ‘垣毀滅之人’ is much better.

[[User:物灵|物灵]] ([[User talk:物灵|talk]]) 02:46, 15 June 2025 (UTC)
: It's a good suggestion, but Dan'a'yo is aiming for intelligibility across CJKV. Postpositions are not common in Mandarin, but they are everywhere else. --[[User:Aquatiki|Aquatiki]] ([[User talk:Aquatiki|talk]]) 16:09, 15 June 2025 (UTC)

My mistake. I have thought there are sentences using 之 like ‘毀滅垣之人’ in the sample, but there are not. But should it be ‘毀滅垣事者’ or something else? [[User:物灵|物灵]] ([[User talk:物灵|talk]]) 07:33, 17 June 2025 (UTC)

==Differences between ㅂ/ㅍ ㄷ/ㅌ ㅈ/ㅊ ㄱ/ㅋ==
An old question, I know. The older [[Tonuao]] tried to remove the distinction, which supposedly proved inconvenient. I wonder how they are distinguished now. I have to summarise from existing examples,

*冬 통, 頭 톳, 発 팓 ([[単亜語/常用字/1|常用字/1]]): why 통 and 팓?
*鳥 촛 ([[単亜語/大学|大学]]): seemingly omitted from modification, given 天 턴 (should be 댯 I guess — or did 촛 continue Mandarin/Xiang taboo?)
*題 테, 反 폰 ([[単亜語/出身論|出身論]])
*飛 피 ([[単亜語/詩経/国風/周南|周南]])
*鳳 풍 ([[単亜語/詩経/小雅/鹿鳴之什/鹿鳴|鹿鳴]])
*帝 테 ([[単亜語/書経/虞書/尭典]])

Most 全濁 initials seem to go into ㅂ/ㄷ/ㅈ, 全清 and 次清 as expected. However I cannot find good explanations for the characters exemplified above.

[[User:物灵|物灵]] ([[User talk:物灵|talk]]) 05:04, 11 November 2025 (UTC)

I guess 鳥 촛 might go after Japanese ちょう non-parallel to 天てん, but in Dan’a’yo this seems to be expected parallel. [[User:物灵|物灵]] ([[User talk:物灵|talk]]) 02:53, 7 December 2025 (UTC)

== A reference on the role of sino-xenic morphemes in Japanese/Korean ==

<blockquote>There is nothing ‘high-’ or ‘low-brow’ for phonetic loans, as is for language itself, nor should those concepts be used in research. However we should recognise that in Japanese, sino-xenic loanwords are not only more ‘internalised’ but can achieve the kind of internalisation not viable for European loanwords. The Chinese–Japanese dictionary, as an example, explains ''dǎpò'' as ''dahasuru. uchiyaru'', while sino-xenic ''dahasuru'' is explained by Kōjien as ''uchiyaru''. There are many more examples.
Phonetically seen, ''daha'' or ''dǎpò'' is irrevelant to ''utsu'' and ''yaburu''. But why did the lexicographers explain like this? Didn’t this reflect some subconsciousness in them? [The subconsciousness might be that,] ''da'' and ''utsu'' is somewhat related, so do ''ha'' and ''yaburu'' [via denoted characters].
音译词本身和语言一样没有高下之分，“高贵”或者“低贱”的概念不该用于研究。但是我们依然应该承认，汉源音译词不仅在日本语体系里更“内化”，而且它本身可借助汉字达到欧源音译词达不到的内化程度。比如我们查词典，汉语“打破”一词中日大辞典解释为“打破する．打ち破る．”，而“打破する”这个汉语借词，广辞苑解释为“打ち破る”。这样的例子还有很多很多。
如果我们只看语音形式，[dähä]或者[täpʰo̞]和[ɯᵝtsɯ]、[jäb ɯᵝɾ ɯᵝ]当然没有半点关系。但是编篡词典的人为什么要这么解释呢？难道这不反映了他们心里的某些潜意识吗？[dä]这个语素和[ɯᵝtsɯ]是联系在一起的，[hä]这个语素和[jäbɯᵝɾɯᵝ]是联系在一起的。
[https://zhuanlan.zhihu.com/p/504877378 日本语的英语借词问题之我见]
</blockquote>

For the development of this language, it is crucial to understand the role of sino-xenic morphemes in Japanese/Korean, since they are not native. I believe the post (though written as a response to an intentionally snarky criticism, and in Chinese), particularly the passages quoted above, is a good start. The fact that ''da'' is somewhat related to ''uchi'' or [https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Template:orthographic_borrowing ''yôpsô'' to ''hagaki''] is a groundstone for this language. This also means that how characters/words are perceived in modern languages is more important than how they are used in classical texts.

[[User:物灵|物灵]] ([[User talk:物灵|talk]]) 08:42, 2 January 2026 (UTC)

Talk:単亜語

2025-12-07T02:54:08Z

物灵: /* Differences between ㅂ/ㅍ ㄷ/ㅌ ㅈ/ㅊ ㄱ/ㅋ */

Talk:単亜語

2025-11-11T05:04:39Z

物灵:

Talk:単亜語

2025-06-17T07:33:25Z

物灵: /* SVO and postpositions */

Dan'a'yo/Lexicography

2025-06-17T06:02:45Z

物灵: /* Astronomy */ this order is ''not'' the same as the days of the week

== LCK ==
=== Astronomy ===
Looking up at the night sky, Dan'a'yo sees an entire "culture" up there, called {{Ruby|天文|턴문}}. The formal study of these celestial objects is {{Ruby|天文学|턴문학}}. This is a true modern science, and not the ancient practice of divination, called {{Ruby|占星術|점성숟}}. (Notice that the first two-characters are the ancient verb "to divine by looking at star signs", {{Ruby|占星|점성}}.). The underlying cognitive metaphor is that we are looking up at a house, with "eaves" and "roof beams", which is why the 'universe/cosmos/space-time' is {{Ruby|宇宙|우줏}}. A 'spaceship' is a {{Ruby|宇宙船|우줏줜}} and an alien or astronaut is an {{Ruby|宇宙人|우줏닌}}.

The basic object in the sky is a "star" {{Ruby|星|성}}, though this also includes planets and moons. To match the English "star", you would need to say 'fixed star', i.e. {{Ruby|恒星|훙성}}. The big ones are the sun - {{Ruby|太陽|태양}} - and moon - {{Ruby|太陰|태임}}. Notice the connection to Yin and Yang. Today, we distinguish planets from stars, so planet is {{Ruby|行星|항성}}. We know that our home is in the solar system {{Ruby|太陽系|태양헤}}. It is made up of
# Mercury - {{Ruby|水星|수성}}
# Venus - {{Ruby|金星|김성}} (ancient people were unaware that this was the same as the Morning Star {{Ruby|啓明|케명}} and the Evening Star {{Ruby|太白星|태박성}})
# Earth - {{Ruby|地球|듸규}}
# Mars - {{Ruby|火星|화성}}
# Jupiter - {{Ruby|木星|목성}}
# Saturn - {{Ruby|土星|토성}} (notice that, skipping the Earth, this order is ''not'' the same as the days of the week)
# Uranus - {{Ruby|天王星|턴왕성}}
# Neptune - {{Ruby|海王星|해왕성}}
# Pluto - {{Ruby|冥王星|멍왕성}} (now a dwarf planet ({{Ruby|矮行星|왜항성}}) because of the discovery of Eris {{Ruby|䦧神星|헉신성}})
Between Mars and Jupiter is the Asteroid Belt {{Ruby|小行星帯|소항성대}} (which is made out of asteroids {{Ruby|小行星|소항성}}), and the region after Neptune is now called the Oort Cloud 오르트{{Ruby|雲|운}}. It is believed that most comets ({{Ruby|彗星|허성}}) come from there. If one of these or some object enteres our atmosphere, it burns up and becomes as 'shooting star' {{Ruby|流星|류성}}.

Our entire solar system is orbiting ({{Ruby|軌道|귀닷}}) within a galaxy ({{Ruby|恒星系|훙성헤}}), specifically, the Milky Way {{Ruby|銀河系|인하헤}}. (This is a bigger word than way we see up the sky, the "silver river" {{Ruby|銀河|인하}}.) Looking out, we see nebulae {{Ruby|星雲|성운}} and novae {{Ruby|新星|신성}}. For millennia, humans have grouped these stars into constellations {{Ruby|星座|성좌}}. They are established, so if you invent your own, it's just an 'asterism' {{Ruby|星群|성군}}.

{|class="wikitable" style="text-align:center;"
|+'''六十干支(天干/地支)'''
|-
! !!木!!火!!土!!金!!水
|-
|style="background: #efefef;"|'''{{Ruby|鼠|쇼}}'''||1（甲{{Ruby|子|지}}）||13（丙{{Ruby|子|지}}）||25（戊{{Ruby|子|지}}）||37（庚{{Ruby|子|지}}）||49（壬{{Ruby|子|지}}）
|-
|style="background: #efefef;"|'''{{Ruby|牛|뇨}}'''||2（乙{{Ruby|丑|추}}）||14（丁{{Ruby|丑|추}}）||26（己{{Ruby|丑|추}}）||38（辛{{Ruby|丑|추}}）||50（癸{{Ruby|丑|추}}）
|-
|style="background: #efefef;"|'''{{Ruby|虎|호}}'''||3（丙{{Ruby|寅|인}}）||15（戊{{Ruby|寅|인}}）||27（庚{{Ruby|寅|인}}）||39（壬{{Ruby|寅|인}}）||51（甲{{Ruby|寅|인}}）
|-
|style="background: #efefef;"|'''{{Ruby|兔|토}}'''||4（丁{{Ruby|卯|먓}}）||16（己{{Ruby|卯|먓}}）||28（辛{{Ruby|卯|먓}}）||40（癸{{Ruby|卯|먓}}）||52（乙{{Ruby|卯|먓}}）
|-
|style="background: #efefef;"|'''{{Ruby|龍|룡}}'''||5（戊{{Ruby|辰|신}}）||17（庚{{Ruby|辰|신}}）||29（壬{{Ruby|辰|신}}）||41（甲{{Ruby|辰|신}}）||53（丙{{Ruby|辰|신}}）
|-
|style="background: #efefef;"|'''{{Ruby|蛇|타}}'''||6（己{{Ruby|巳|시}}）||18（辛{{Ruby|巳|시}}）||30（癸{{Ruby|巳|시}}）||42（乙{{Ruby|巳|시}}）||54（丁{{Ruby|巳|시}}）
|-
|style="background: #efefef;"|'''{{Ruby|馬|마}}'''||7（庚{{Ruby|午|오}}）||19（壬{{Ruby|午|오}}）||31（甲{{Ruby|午|오}}）||43（丙{{Ruby|午|오}}）||55（戊{{Ruby|午|오}}）
|-
|style="background: #efefef;"|'''{{Ruby|羊|양}}'''||8（辛{{Ruby|未|뮈}}）||20（癸{{Ruby|未|뮈}}）||32（乙{{Ruby|未|뮈}}）||44（丁{{Ruby|未|뮈}}）||56（己{{Ruby|未|뮈}}）
|-
|style="background: #efefef;"|'''{{Ruby|猿|온}}'''||9（壬{{Ruby|申|선}}）||21（甲{{Ruby|申|선}}）||33（丙{{Ruby|申|선}}）||45（戊{{Ruby|申|선}}）||57（庚{{Ruby|申|선}}）
|-
|style="background: #efefef;"|'''{{Ruby|鶏|게}}'''||10（癸酉）||22（乙酉）||34（丁酉）||46（己酉）||58（辛酉）
|-
|style="background: #efefef;"|'''{{Ruby|狗|구}}'''||11（甲戌）||23（丙戌）||35（戊戌）||47（庚戌）||59（壬戌）
|-
|style="background: #efefef;"|'''{{Ruby|猪|조}}'''||12（乙亥）||24（丁亥）||36（己亥）||48（辛亥）||60（癸亥）
|-
|}

=== Colors ===
black - {{Ruby|黒|huk}}
blue - {{Ruby|青|ceng}}
brown - {{term|茶色}} tea color, {{Ruby|褐|hat}}
color - {{Ruby|色彩|sikcai}}
grey - {{term|灰色}} ash color, {{term|鼠色}} rat color
green - {{Ruby|緑|lok}}
orange - {{term|橙色}} orange color
pink - {{term|桃色}}
purple - {{term|紫色}}
red - {{Ruby|紅|hong}} (crimson), {{Ruby|赤|cek}} red
white - {{Ruby|白|bak}}
yellow - {{Ruby|黄|hwang}}

=== Metals ===
gold : {{Ruby|黄金|hwanggim}}
iron: {{Ruby|鉄|tet}}
lead : {{Ruby|鉛|'yen}}
metal : {{Ruby|金属|gimjok}}
silver : {{Ruby|銀|'in}}
steel : {{Ruby|鋼鉄|gangtet}}
tin : {{Ruby|朱錫|jusek}}

copper, zinc, bronze, brass, mercury : {{Ruby|銅|dong}}, {{Ruby|亜鉛|'a'yen}}, {{Ruby|青銅|cengdong}}, {{Ruby|黄銅|hwangdong}}, {{Ruby|水銀|sui'in}}
forge, anvil, alloy, ore : (v) {{Ruby|鍛錬|dwanlen}}, {{Ruby|鉄砧|tetdum}}, {{Ruby|合金|kapgim}}, {{Ruby|鉱石|gwangsek}}

[[Category:Dan'a'yo]]
{{Aquatiki}}

Talk:単亜語

2025-06-15T02:47:13Z

物灵: Created page with "==SVO and postpositions== SVO languages predominantly use prepositions. Indeed, there are notable exceptions that employ postpositions. Finnish is a prime example of an SVO language with postpositions, despite its Proto-Uralic roots suggesting a more verb-final structure. In West Africa, several Niger-Congo languages, such as those spoken in Côte d’Ivoire and Ghana, maintain SVO word order while using postpositions. And Guarani, an indigenous language of South America..."

User talk:Aquatiki

2025-06-15T01:09:16Z

物灵: /* Dan'a'yo */

=== Welcome ===
'''Welcome to ''Linguifex''!'''
We hope you will contribute much and well.
You will probably want to read the [[Help:Contents|help pages]].
Again, welcome and have fun! [[File:Waahlis.png|35px|link=Linguifex:Administrators]] '''[[User talk:Waahlis|Waahlis]]''' 14:41, 8 December 2013 (CET)

== Ílchőfti Lēmáthīd ==

ברוך הבא ל-Linguifex; רפרפתי פעם על השפות העבריות הפולינזיות שלך וממש התרשמתי. אני בטוח שאתה תסכים איתי שצריכות להיות עוד שפות חלופיות :-) אם יש לך זמן בבקשה תן לי את דעתך על השפות שלי. אני מודה, אני מתבייש מכך שהן מתבססות קצת יותר מדי בעברית ויפנית...

בהצלחה,

[[User:Ílchőfti Lēmáthīd|Ílchőfti Lēmáthīd]] ([[User talk:Ílchőfti Lēmáthīd|talk]]) 17:44, 8 December 2013 (CET)

: Wow! Your stuff is amazing! Sorry to reply in English: I'm on a friend's computer without Hebrew! Do you mean [[Themsaran]]? There seem to be a lot of influences there, so no one natlang really sticks out. The tones, clusivity, and bipersonal agreement certainly don't look Hebrew or Japanese! Did you mean a different language of yours? I hope to get home this afternoon and move a lot of things here. [[User:Aquatiki|Aquatiki]] ([[User talk:Aquatiki|talk]]) 18:03, 8 December 2013 (CET)

==Classmeter==
Hi! ^^Regarding the classification meter, it's actually tagged as causing layout errors. I am not sure if this flaw has yet to be fixed; I cannot see anything odd with your page. Well, considering this, I suppose you can use it! I shall change the colour scheme though.

Regards,
[[File:Waahlis.png|35px|link=Linguifex:Administrators]] '''[[User talk:Waahlis|Waahlis]]''' 12:06, 10 December 2013 (CET)

==Images==
Hi, thanks for adding categories to a metric fuck-ton of images :P [[File:PMOB.png|35px|link=Linguifex:Administrators]] '''[[User:PMOB|Pá mamūnám ontā́ bán]]''' 10:52, 11 February 2014 (CET)
: I think the SI units are tonne-fuck, because French is head-initial! ;-) Your welcome! --[[User:Aquatiki|Aquatiki]] ([[User talk:Aquatiki|talk]]) 14:26, 11 February 2014 (CET)

== Spam issues (march 2025) ==

I will be checking why our advanced captcha has stopped working for us. How unfortunate! [[File:Admin.png|35px|link=Linguifex:Administrators]] '''[[User talk:Chrysophylax|Χρυσοφύλαξ]]''' 22:52, 12 March 2025 (UTC)

== Dan'a'yo ==

Are there discussions of Dan'a'yo outside of this website or Facebook?
[[User:物灵|物灵]] ([[User talk:物灵|talk]]) 01:08, 15 June 2025 (UTC)

User talk:Aquatiki

2025-06-15T01:08:22Z

物灵: /* Dan'a'yo */ new section